Hubby and I are butting heads on this one.

Recap: Mom went into the NH this past May. On the whole she's settled in well. The staff loves her. They've made it a point to link Mom up with a few others who are roughly at the same level as her. She has PT every morning and participates in all the activities, ALZ-floor related or not (an activity aide brings her down to the non-ALZ floor for bingo and such). Except for a few bouts of severe sundowning, she's basically on a plateau, no changes in meds, no marked deterioration, etc.

We try to visit every day (the NH is a 20-minute drive from here), which is all well and good, but now I'm having my doubts as to whether this is a "good" thing. The resident social worker warned us that visiting every day, at least at the beginning, wasn't a good idea because it'd reinforce that "when am I going home?" thing that most new NH residents have. Mom's over that stage, thank goodness.

I find that visiting every day is a bit, well...anticlimatic. We try to take Mom out for dinner or an ice cream once a week; sometimes we'll take her for a ride. I find that I run out of things to talk about otherwise. A project? Mom's always been a crafty sort, but between the ALZ and her eyesight, she's either not interested or gets incredibly frustrated. I've given her a few manicures, but that's not something I can do every day. We sometimes bring the dogs to visit, but most of the time my attention's more toward them than her.

It's not that I want or should scale back the visits, but now I realize why I see so few families around there on a regular basis. What is there to do? What to talk about besides the superficial things like the weather or how everyone's at home (if they can remember, that is). Am I making sense? Do you know what I mean?

Signed,
A Very Frustrated EM

Em, that sounds like nothing but the truth, if not the whole truth. I am glad to hear she is adjusting.

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Originally posted by T.O.R.P.: I agree. Plus, they do tend to have flashes of certain cognizance and we don't want to do anything that could plant seeds of mistrust in their brains. They're hard enough to manage when they trust us implicitly.

I still think that somewhere in that tangled mass of brain matter Mom knows she's in a NH. We never mention it directly though -- we tell her that she now lives "there" because she wobbles too much (true) and needs the type of help hubby and I can no longer give her (also true). Considering that she no longer asks to go home, I'd reckon she's accepted our explanation.

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Originally posted by Bobcat:
I think my Mom would take my word for most anything, but I also believe that is because, to date, I have not resorted to tricks. I want to keep it that way.

I have no experience with NHs, only what gets passed on to me here, and what I have researshed, just in case.

The real word is worth so much.

I agree. Plus, they do tend to have flashes of certain cognizance and we don't want to do anything that could plant seeds of mistrust in their brains. They're hard enough to manage when they trust us implicitly.

Not that we ALWAYS tell her ALL of the truth. Either way, two chances whether she'll remember. But for conscience sake, we try to keep an essence of truth. For example, re potential of theft by other residents: this does happen, bless their hearts. On the other hand, we're leaving out the issue of her using bad judgement, and the potential of one of the newly hired night staff helping themselves. (It, sadly, happens even in the best of facilities.) But we don't want her to get hostile by "accusing" her of being dotty, or plant a seed of mistrust in the staff there which might make her uncooperative.

As it is, I still occasionally get calls to come talk her into taking her pills. She'll get it into her head that they are giving her the wrong meds, and wants someone she trusts (i.e. family) to look at the pills and reassure her that they do, indeed, belong to her.

Hap, those are beautiful methods. I especially like greetings for hall mates. A moment to socialize, may be just a moment, But it is so real while it happens. What a great idea.

And to keep cards sent with envelopes, when Mom gets no personal mail for a while, she wants to see the old mail and talk of those people. When my niece went on a trip, she asked me what would be a good souvineer for Grandma, and I told her to forget the nickknacks, send post cards. Getting mail is so special.

visiting in nh is one of the hardest things to do to keep occupied and keep a conversation going. things i have found useful are to have a few photo albums handy, for different periods of their lives. it doesn't matter how often they see these, you might go nuts, but to many of them it may spark something and give you an idea of where they are in time. identify each person, if they have passed away skip the details please. too much for them to process or to relive.brightly cover and decorate a shoebox and keep all greeting cards and some special pictures of lo and ones of your closest family or her friends in it. to daisy a greeting card from 4 years ago is as good as today's mail. read them all out loud together. it makes them feel very special that someone sent them mail. try to keep the envelopes so they can also be opened each time. get a chapter book and read, some illustrations are good to take a break and talk about the pictures. daisy likes little house on the prairie, anne of green gables and children's books with bright pictures or pop up books. she gets a kick out of the pictures. make a scapbook, you don't have to buy all the fancy equipment, just anything you can glue or paste to the pages to bling them up a little, things around the house. ribbon, flat buttons, pictures of flowers , birds or animals cut from magazines, etc. take some magazines and search together for pictures to cut. get safety scissors to use to cut out things together and keep these in a separate box, also beautifully covered a decorated. washable markers to decorate and label pictures. glue sticks, felt and fabric scraps. just look around the house, collect old greeting cards and cut out the pictures on them. get construction paper and make greeting cards for family members or for others in the nh to cheer them up. take a short walk to deliver them. make them for the staff. anything like this will fill time and you will have something to show for it at the same time. a lot of chatter can take place trying to get them involved and praising their efforts.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: fat, dumb and happy,

T.O.R.P, Your experience is as good as gold. I think my Mom would take my word for most anything, but I also believe that is because, to date, I have not resorted to tricks. I want to keep it that way.

I have no experience with NHs, only what gets passed on to me here, and what I have researshed, just in case.

The real word is worth so much.

Our LO would DEFINITELY recognize that it was play money. The activity director at the NH will keep a small "slush fund" for the resident in an envelope in her safe. It's never more than $10-$20, preferably in one dollar bills, and she gives us an accounting of it when it needs replenishing. Our LO occasionally will request someone to buy her a soft drink from the machine in the nurse's lounge, or now and then the director will allow her and her roommate to order out fast food to eat in their room, as a treat, when they are having a fairly alert day. (They have our permission, in writing, to do this.)

They can do this and just add it to her bill at the end of the month, but several of the residents prefer to be able to "buy" things with their "own money."

She's content to have the director keep it because we explain to her, "Some of the OTHER residents get confused, and might take your money because they think it's theirs." (She, of course, is NEVER confused. heh) As long as she has money readily available, she feels more secure. It may relate to having grown up during the depression.

Hannah, it is a personal call. I also, am reluctant to use trickery with my Mom, but my situation is different. Mom is content right now to know, I have her money. But I always keep a few ones in her wallet. Sometimes a CG will tell her, I am taking my child to the zoo tomorrow , or some such, and Mom wants to give a dollar so the child can buy someting special and think of her. True , a dollar won't buy anything at the zoo or the circus anymore, but she thinks it is a grand gesture, and for her it is. So I keep a few dollars in her purse for her to give away. I am not sure, if it was monopoly money, she would know the diff, because her eyesight is so bad, and don't care.

I don't know why your Mom thinks she needs money, but she does think so. For me, that would be enough. Play money, wouldn't violate the rules, and might let her feel some security. To me, under the circumstances, I would consider it. Just for her peace of mind. You might ask the administration , if this has come up before(I don't doubt it has) and if so, how it was handled.

Ways to ease anxiety and help them feel that they are "in the world" are often worthwhile. Like I said, I am reluctant for manipulation, but it is about them at this stage, not us, at least at times. A little game that makes them feel better isn't all bad.

Me, I would do this, if faced with it. They have more realistic fake money at the dollar store for kid's games. Monopoly Money may not work. It wouldn't fool my Mom, but this is about their comfort, still we need to keep within our own comfort zone too. Hard call. I would do it.

I hope in other circumstances

I totally hear you Em, on the issue of trying to find things to say and running out of ideas!!! I think we try and do that because if we were conversing in the non-dementia world we would do that. But in their world, I don't think they care all that much if we say the same things or run out of conversation. We bring our puppies because it is a constant source of something to talk about. If all else fails Mom can hold one or pet one. Still we have trouble always with filling the visit. We do shorter visits, more freqently and it helps.

But here is another question in the same vein... My Mom always asks for money. She has always done this. She looses it or gives it away. Well now that she is in the NH dementia unit she can't have any money because it is against the rules for residents to keep cash. I tell her; "You don't need any money, everything is paid for." Or "I don't have any money with me, next time I'll try and bring some." My sil wants us to get monopoly money and give it to her and for some reason this really bugs me. I feel like it is taking advantage of her inability to know the difference. Now we all "lie" all the time to our loved ones to avoid certain upsets or make something simple to understand. I do it too. But this just feels wrong to me. Am I just being touchy? Any thoughts???

EM, posting got a way from me a bit, but I did want to tell you what a great job you are doing. Some where in another post, the idea of a few scratch off lottery tickets came up. Several people mentioned that to their surprise, it gave a little boost to a slow moment. Mom never approved of gambling, but she thinks this is kinda of fun, since the profits are "supposed" to go to the school system . She has trouble holding the coin and doing the scratch, but she will apply herself to the task. She can't really read the results, and I am not in the habit of telling her little white lies, but if she keeps fretting about affording her new hearing aids, I MIGHT consider telling her she WON the money. Who knows, maybe she will.?

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Who's the one constant in her life she can rely on to "make it better"? Me. And because of that, I have a responsibility because she's my MOTHER.

A true role reversal. When I was little I had a fear that a monster would come through the attic door and attack me. She was the one who comforted me. Kind of makes one think, doesn't it?

Sigh... bigtime hugs to ya, EM. To me, it is more like we've come full circle. They taught us how to comfort by comforting and protecting us and now's when it all comes back to them. Those are mighty sweet, irreplaceable moments. The talk doesn't matter much - just the human touch from someone who knows us!

Mom and I have a running joke about this... she tells me how good the dinner I made is and I tell her that's because she taught me how to cook. Then she says, well, she sure is glad that she did! And I laugh and say THAT'S time and effort that paid off, huh Mom?

Me? I think you did a whole lot better than "didn't do too badly" - for what it's worth, I think you did great.

[QUOTE]"To tell you the truth, it was the hand holding and hair playing that made more of an impact on her than anything else. She seemed so touched by it. While I was talking, she kept stroking my hand and telling me how much she loved me. I tried not to cry. I burst into tears the moment I got into the truck."

I'm tearing up! These are truly the GOLDEN moments they give us! It warms my heart, Em.
Thanks for sharing.

(((hugs))) Em I hear you it is a comfort thing and what a precious moment you spent with her....it just seems to make everything else fade when you hear those 3 little words "I Love You"
I miss that most....

Sorry for the pause there -- I worked all weekend and this is the first time I've had to sit down and think about all this.

I didn't do too badly last night. They had just put her to bed when I got there (around 7:30), so she was somewhat awake. For once she knew who I was (I just had my hair cut, so now she thinks I'm her son until she hears my voice. I have no siblings, btw). I held her hand, played with her hair, and gave her the rundown of how hubby's been sick, how hot it's been, my work's going OK (it really isn't, but I wasn't going to tell her that), and that we'll take her out for dinner when hubby feels better.

To tell you the truth, it was the hand holding and hair playing that made more of an impact on her than anything else. She seemed so touched by it. While I was talking, she kept stroking my hand and telling me how much she loved me. I tried not to cry. I burst into tears the moment I got into the truck.

I think my presence is more of a "comfort" thing than anything else. I'm looking at it from her perspective -- here she is in a place where a lot of her hall-mates are in much later stages. As befuddled as she is, there is still a semblance of "what am I doing here?" Then she drifts off into a bout of paranoia and fear because she doesn't understand why she's there and where is everything and everyone she's familiar with? Of course that makes her afraid! She doesn't know what's going on or, if she does, she can't explain it rationally. Who's the one constant in her life she can rely on to "make it better"? Me. And because of that, I have a responsibility becauseshe's my MOTHER.

A true role reversal. When I was little I had a fear that a monster would come through the attic door and attack me. [i]She]/i] was the one who comforted me. Kind of makes one think, doesn't it?

Em I have to agree entirely with MB here He was her Primary so it would be a really good idea to allow him permissions here sweetie I mean seriously I am mirroring your H here if I was told after all the mess I went through here with my MIL for 10 years and knowing every little thing about her care that my H hasnt a clue on, that I wasnt allowed the privilege to question about care you betcher sweet butt my Hunny would have a sideways look at the ground the first time someone said to me "Im sorry I cant give that info" Uh no and Im not kidding!

We can be control freaks without a doubt Em and I know that has caused much friction and I feel bad sweetie I really do but that man took care of your mom and while she IS your mom and there are certain privileges that go along with that he is doing nothing wrong really that I can find fault with. Hes losing control sweetie hes frustrated and that is gonna happen Em just nod and be done with it....

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That doesn't resolve the what to do issue

Some folks can while away time better than others. A visit isn't ALL about activity - it can be about just being together for a bit.

Conversing with people is a fine art. We choose our topics and delivery based upon the level of the person with whom we are conversing. If I am talking to a 6 month old, it sounds different from when I speak with a 10 year old, etc. When conversing with our loved ones, we usually have to take the lead in the conversation as they cannot do so well. Try to keep it light and don't stay long on one subject (they won't!). Talk about the weather. Then talk about something else familiar. Tell her about a bird you saw or a crazy hairdo; what they had for dinner; their favorite color or flavor of ice cream; do they like the nurses?; how is their "friend" next door feeling today; did you see the decorations in the hallway? I brought this magazine for you to look at - it has wonderful pictures of the beach and I know how you love the beach!

Visiting people at nursing homes is not an easy thing and it is hard for most folks to go daily. Again, the visit does not have to consist of non-stop activity and conversation - sometimes it is enough to simply be there together.

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hubby's still trying to micromanage her just like he did when she was here. He can't stand the thought that anyone "less competent" than himself is in charge of her care.

Once a caregiver, always a caregiver! He can't HELP himself! *chuckle* And kudos to him for grilling them on whether they are attending to her needs like cleaning her teeth daily!!! Those will be questions that you don't have to remember but are SOOOOOO important to have answers! If the staff cannot "legally" tell him whether they have brushed her teeth that day (god forbid that common sense should overtake HIPPA rules ), I think I would make SURE that he is given permission by you to the nursing home to ask questions and receive answers. After all, he was her primary caregiver for quite some time... he is watching for signs of neglect. The real truth of the matter is they don't want you to ask because they do not want to have to answer. It would raise my radar to a new level if someone told me they could not discuss whether my MIL's dentures had been cleaned because of "Privacy Laws." I would wonder what's to hide?

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Now he finds himself "too busy" to visit her everyday. Ergo, I should be the one visiting every other day (even after a 12-hour work day, hello?!?) because I'm her daughter. I honestly don't think either of us needs to visit every day. Every other day, perhaps. She IS being well taken care of, in my opinion. They WILL call if something's askew (they've done so before). I know hubby's trying to project his fear of her-deteriorating-to-a-vegetable-within-months onto me, thereby making ME feel guilty she's there. Newsflash: She's MY mom. I placed her for a reason, so HUSH.

It sounds like your husband is caught between the devil and the deep blue sea! It is HARD to relinquish control of a patient to others, particularly a facility full of people we don't know from Adam! On the one hand, he is busy and relieved not to be caring for her. On the other, once he is there, he starts through the caregiver's mental check list... It sounds like he has some conflicting feelings... but those are his and he is the only one who can deal with them.

How long of a visit are you trying to make? I think just 15-30 minutes is enough to "stay up" with them - you may want to reserve some time to interface with the staff. I know it's a long way to go for a short time, but I honestly don't think that you need to spend hours several times a week! Maybe keep it short & sweet once or twice during the week and pick one of the weekend days to visit a little longer.

Good luck! Are things feeling better to you now that your Mom's care is not in your home under your nose? I sure hope so!

See, that's the thing. Although he'll deny it up and down, hubby's still trying to micromanage her just like he did when she was here. He can't stand the thought that anyone "less competent" than himself is in charge of her care. He isn't belligerent by any stretch, but I've been told that he drives the nursing staff nuts with the smallest things ("Are you cleaning her dentures EVERY NIGHT?" -- that sort of thing) Legally they can't tell him anything because he's not Mom's proxy

Now he finds himself "too busy" to visit her everyday. Ergo, I should be the one visiting every other day (even after a 12-hour work day, hello?!?) because I'm her daughter. I honestly don't think either of us needs to visit every day. Every other day, perhaps. She IS being well taken care of, in my opinion. They WILL call if something's askew (they've done so before). I know hubby's trying to project his fear of her-deteriorating-to-a-vegetable-within-months onto me, thereby making ME feel guilty she's there. Newsflash: She's MY mom. I placed her for a reason, so HUSH.

That doesn't resolve the what to do issue, though. BG has a good idea about the books. I'm just wondering how much she'd be able to follow along, as her ear/mind connection's starting to become as wonky as the eye/mind. It's worth a try, though

Mom can no longer follow any type of TV. I sometimes take her downstairs to the commons room. There's a new wide-screen TV there. We tried watching the "old standards" music channel and she couldn't sit still long enough for any type of conversation.

Turns out that I can't visit either tonight or tomorrow because of work. We'll see what happens (or how hubby will react)...

I too em understand what you are saying. I tried to visit Mom daily but I knew if I missed a day here or there it was ok cause her friends stopped to visit too. I was fortunate that MOm was about 10 mins away.

Many days in the NH we just sat together & watched the country music channel.

Do what feels right for you em. 20 mins is a long drive for daily visits & no one is going to call you a "bad dtr" for having a life of your own too. You done more for your Mom than many children would ever consider doing-don't forget that!

Hiya EM - good to hear from you! When my gramma was in the NH, her 3 kids all settled into seperate visiting times. My uncle would go every morning to have coffee with her, then after she became less able, he'd feed her her breakfast. His visits were not long - just a flyby on the way to his office.

For both you and your husband to have to go may be too much... Perhaps you could wean her off the daily visits by switching every other day wwith your husband, then skipping one here and there until the visits are at a reasonable level for your schedule. Visiting people somewhere other than at home on a daily basis is very difficult - I hope y'all will find a solution.